Tokyo Orchid Nursery flasks

[Tom-DE]

and you totally believe that? Why don't you google and see what you will find? I drove into Canada few times in my life also, I never declared anything or the Agents would check my trunk. I guess I would call myself lucky too(only if I ever would smuggle in some orchids). Some people in U.S. shipped some plants to some parts of EU without correct paper works two or three years ago, Hey, they all got lucky at the beginning, I bet they won't do it again.

and FYI, without permits and paper works, it is a fat chance to import orchids from Japan legally.

 

[gonewild]

Lance, I believe that was in the old days. After CITES, things have changed a bit. correct me if I am wrong, even the Canadian hobbyists now will have to hide the plants when they come back to Canada from U.S. if they don't have papers.

Few years ago, the Canadian gov't even gave someone a huge fine for bringing in some dry/dead Dendrobium canes without papers--(to sell them as Chinese or Vietnamese medicine)

The key difference in your example is that that the Dendrobium canes were a commercial import (to sell).

A search of the CFIA rules accesses this form....
http://airs-sari.inspection.gc.ca/airs_external/english/decisions-eng.aspx
If you follow it's path you will see that bareroot orchids are considered as houseplants. Travelers are allowed to carry in 50 plants or less without having an import permit or phyto cert. But plants must be declared and are subject to inspection. (This assumes the plants originate from USA).

It does not mention any CITES requirement which could be a consideration, but since the import is non commercial, CITES may not apply, especially to hybrids.

 

[Tom-DE]

Lance, I will check on that link further later. I did try but I wasn't able get to what you just referred to.
Now, I would like to know if it is perfectly okay for me to ship plants to Canada without papers. I am just a hobbyist. I am not so sure about this.... When I decided to sell all my plants, I told people I would not ship plants to Canada, HI, AK because of the regulations.

 

[gonewild]

Lance, I would like to know if it is perfectly legal for me to ship plants to Canada without papers. I am just a hobbyist. I am not so sure about this....

No, you can not ship the plants without permits.
From what the online regs say the plants must be hand carried across the border. That would mean in your luggage and in your possession.

 

[Tom-DE]

Thanks, that is what I thought for mail orders.

so it is okay to hand carry plants(US origin) into Canada. Great!
What about bringing(hand carry) plants into USA from Canada? Our(U.S.) gov't may ask more documents.

I remember few years ago a couple of Canadian forum members mentioned they had trouble to bring in plants without papers when they attended Redlands show in FL. I guess it was because they had too many plants from foreign vendors at that show?

 

[gonewild]

You need permits to legally bring orchids into the USA.
That is why Eric said Canada is easier than the USA.

 

[gonewild]

Thanks, that is what I thought for mail orders.

I remember few years ago a couple of Canadian forum members mentioned they had troouble to bring in plants without papers when they attended Redlands show in FL. I guess it was because they had too many plants from foreign vendors at that show?

50 plants is the maximum.
Large numbers of plants will look like it is a commercial importation. Remember the allowance is to accommodate the Canadian resident hobbyist/gardner.

 

[cnycharles]

I remember few years ago a couple of Canadian forum members mentioned they had trouble to bring in plants without papers when they attended Redlands show in FL. I guess it was because they had too many plants from foreign vendors at that show?

Likely they were from foreign origin, not us or just too many


Elmer Nj

 

[NYEric]

If you have seen my miscellaneous stuff thread you know that I had plants seized and paid a fine for not declaring coming into the USA, that time I did not have time to wait for the plant inspector. You can also see that i hand carried plants, sans bark, into Canada and declared them. no paperwork needed. This is how the OZ besseaes and Paph seedlings that some of our STF people in Canada were able to get them. I'm not telling people to break any laws, just telling you my experiences, I read the rules.

 

[Tom-DE]

John, you know that Canada is far less restrictive than the USA when it comes to importing plants, don't you!?

Eric, sorry if I might have jumped the gun on you a bit too early but this is how it started. You are talking about "importing" in general, which I still don't think Canada is that much easier than USA. The topic here is about how to "import" flask/plants from Japan, at least that is what John C. was saying before you posted your first commend.

Edit:I was certainly not clear about the "hand carry" rule for US origin plants, but I did hear a few Canadian hobbyists could not bring in(in car) Madagascar (origin)/wild Angreacoids without legal papers and few other incidents, such as Redland show story. So, not all the plants you purchase in US can be brought in Canada without papers, you can't bring all plants into US without some legal documents either.

 

[NYEric]

No problem.
As John said,
" flasks are not so difficult to import. So you could do it directly. Paperwork and risk is much worse for plants.".
My point was, that it is easier to bring plants to Canada than the USA. In fact it is easier also to bring flasks in. The authorities do not question whether the parent plants that the flasks were made from were legally obtained , which the do here sometimes.

 

[Tom-DE]

Back to the original question.... flask is always easier to import than plants, even for USA. "importing or exporting"(I am not talking about hand-carrying now) for Canada is not much easier than USA. You need permits and do the paper works in order to import or export flasks or plants. You want to disagree with that, it is fine.


Edit: I would like to have a good answer for my following question: Now I have learned hobbyists can hand-carry a few plants into Canada, but can I do that legally(declare at the border) without receipts or invoice? I would like to bring a couple of hybrid Paphs from my collection to my friend in Toronto this summer...obviously I don't have the old receipts or invoices or even an old nursery tag by now. Is it doable?

 

[papheteer]

After seeing how much the cost of shipping and permits will be, add to that the cost of the flasks themselves, I've decided to just stick with Ten shin/hung sheng flasks for now. Plus I heard the seedlings of the Ho Chi Minh album crosses have colored leaves anyways. Definitely not worth it. Someday I'll attend that JGP show.. Someday..

 

[Happypaphy7]

Tom is right in that the regulations regarding what's allowed into the country and not are similar in Canada and USA.
I was at Edmonton airport in 2008, and I was asked to throw away my apple, yes, one apple from USA grown in Washington state, which is the same apple sold in Canada.
As ridiculous as it may seems, given the high volume of visitors into the country, they just have to stick to the law without flexibility.
So I see the point.

One must have luck to bring live plants ( does not matter if it's an orchid not) without paper works.

It is sort of like water bottle or any liquid bottle larger than 3 oz not allowed past security check after terror attack, even though vast majority of those are just innocent water or juice with no bombs.
It just makes things simple and easy to process.

Hobby growers experience great inconvenience in this.
Not related to CITES, but plants and plant materials are not allowed most of the time because of the concern of spreading unwanted diseases and pests. What's funny is large commercial trades with permit are the main cause of the problems.
Insects and disease come in with produce.
And the amount coming in on a daily basis is huge!
Prisonous spiders on bananas is rather recent example.

Anyways, back to the main point, where can one find flask list of TON??
And more importantly, price?? Since their plants cost fortune.

 

[NYEric]

Plus I heard the seedlings of the Ho Chi Minh album crosses have colored leaves anyways. Definitely not worth it. Someday I'll attend that JGP show.. Someday..

Are there any Paph leaves that do not have green in them?

 

[NYEric]

You want to disagree with that, it is fine.


Edit: I would like to have a good answer for my following question: Now I have learned hobbyists can hand-carry a few plants into Canada, but can I do that legally(declare at the border) without receipts or invoice? I would like to bring a couple of hybrid Paphs from my collection to my friend in Toronto this summer...obviously I don't have the old receipts or invoices or even an old nursery tag by now. Is it doable?

Obviously, now no disagreement is necessary!
Yes, you can, no bark. Refer to post #3 and #5 in this thread.

 

[papheteer]

Are there any Paph leaves that do not have green in them?

Lol. What I meant was the leaves are normal coloured. With purple pigments I guess.

 

[NYEric]

Lol. What I meant was the leaves are normal coloured. With purple pigments I guess.

Hmmmm, I will check when I get home tonight.

 

[papheteer]

Hmmmm, I will check when I get home tonight.

You have a flaskful??! From where? can I buy some? Plssss hehehe

 

[Tom-DE]

Obviously, now no disagreement is necessary!
Yes, you can, no bark. Refer to post #3 and #5 in this thread.

then, how do you prove the "U.S. origin" at the very minimum level? I found it quite unclear, questionable and somewhat amusing.