K-Lite Trial

[Ray]

Sorry, all committed.

Not to worry, if we see something interesting - or conversely, don't see anything obviously negative - I'm sure well be reordering to keep up the supply, and you can jump in then.

 

[Rick]

I was wondering the same thing, should have paid more attention to the thread.

Bill

In the meantime you could use the work around I've been using for the last 6 or so months.

1/8 tsp each (for winter) of MSU, Ca NO3, and MgSO4

 

[cabnc]

April Trip

Ray,

"1/8 tsp each (for winter) of MSU, Ca NO3, and MgSO4"

How much water is this added to ?? How does the mix change for spring / summer ??

Any thought of getting more K-Lite to sell on your April Trip / speaking engagements into North Carolina ??

Charlie
VP CFOS
Wilmington, NC

 

[Rick]

Ray,

"1/8 tsp each (for winter) of MSU, Ca NO3, and MgSO4"

How much water is this added to ?? How does the mix change for spring / summer ??

Any thought of getting more K-Lite to sell on your April Trip / speaking engagements into North Carolina ??

Charlie
VP CFOS
Wilmington, NC

I came up with this actually. The general idea was to "dilute" the K in the MSU with supplemental Nitrogen from calcium nitrate and increased Mg sulfate. Those amounts are for 1 gallon of water, and I feed once a week (in winter I skip when its not sunny, so sometimes every 2-3 weeks). In summer I was using a 1/4 tsp each per gal.

The irrigation water should be soft-very soft water (but not straight RO).

To be precise, the MgSO4 is anhydrous (not Epsom salts) and the Ca Nitrate has 4 waters of hydration.

If you can only get Epsom salts then use 1/4 tsp/gal instead of 1/8 tsp.

 

[billc]

I've been using this for the last 2 months or so after reading some of the posts Rick and Rick H. had posted their thoughts and observations on the benefits of diluting the K and upping the calcium and magnesium levels.
http://grotekusa.com/products/guide/product.asp?code=calmax

I didn't really pay that much attention in chemistry class all those years ago, so I'm getting a little lost with all the formulations being tossed back and forth in the threads, but this stuff seemed to fit the bill.

I'm using it @1/4 tsp Cal-Max, 1/4 tsp MSU(pure water) per gallon every other watering.

Bill

 

[Brabantia]

I'm using it @1/4 tsp Cal-Max, 1/4 tsp MSU(pure water) per gallon every other watering.
Bill

Caution: on reading the Grotek CalMag data sheet I see that Ca (Calcium) is from Calcium chloride. Maybe this is not very important for vegetables culture in soil ... but for Paphs and Phrags ??

 

[Rick]

Caution: on reading the Grotek CalMag data sheet I see that Ca (Calcium) is from Calcium chloride. Maybe this is not very important for vegetables culture in soil ... but for Paphs and Phrags ??

Can't say about paphs or phrags generally, but I don't think that amount of chloride would put a dent in orchids generally.

Remember that a few paph species (supposedly salt sensitive species) live so close to the ocean that they get sprayed with salt water (tons of chloride in that). And all the growers using tap water from rivers and lakes get a good amount of chloride in that.

I also uncovered a paper on optimizing K use in hybrid phales production (high K!), but the Ca, Mg, and much of the K was added as the chloride salts of these elements so chloride ended up as much as 100 ppm too!

So at this point I haven't seen anything specific for phrags. They may be special.

I'm thinking that sodium and chloride may be a form of antidote for keeping K from locking up a plant.

 

[Rick]

I've been using this for the last 2 months or so after reading some of the posts Rick and Rick H. had posted their thoughts and observations on the benefits of diluting the K and upping the calcium and magnesium levels.
http://grotekusa.com/products/guide/product.asp?code=calmax

I didn't really pay that much attention in chemistry class all those years ago, so I'm getting a little lost with all the formulations being tossed back and forth in the threads, but this stuff seemed to fit the bill.

I'm using it @1/4 tsp Cal-Max, 1/4 tsp MSU(pure water) per gallon every other watering.

Bill

Any results yet?

"Every other watering" really doesn't tell me what your frequency of watering is. If you water only once a week then I think you would be fine, but if you water more than once a week, then you might want to slow your feeding down some.

 

[Jim Toomey]

Observations seen during the two months?

 

[billc]

I'm watering probably 3 times every 2 weeks. I haven't seen any changes either good or bad. The plants have slowed down some due to the lower temps in winter. I grow in an unheated basement and the night time temps are about 52-55 degrees F. Day time, when the lights are on, is about 72-75F. The roots I can see in the clear pots look good with nice white tips so I don't think I'm hurting them.


Bill

 

[Rick]

I'm watering probably 3 times every 2 weeks. I haven't seen any changes either good or bad. The plants have slowed down some due to the lower temps in winter. I grow in an unheated basement and the night time temps are about 52-55 degrees F. Day time, when the lights are on, is about 72-75F. The roots I can see in the clear pots look good with nice white tips so I don't think I'm hurting them.


Bill

What is the chemistry of your irrigation water without fertilizer in it?

 

[billc]

What is the chemistry of your irrigation water without fertilizer in it?

I use rainwater most of the year. I really have no idea of the chemistry of that, other than it's probably on the acidic side. Once in a while in the dead of winter, if everything is frozen precipitation, I'll get a few gallons of RO at the grocery store and add a tad less than 1/8 tsp MSU to that . In this year of no winter so far I may be able to use rainwater all winter:wink:.

Bill

 

[Rick]

I use rainwater most of the year. I really have no idea of the chemistry of that, other than it's probably on the acidic side. Once in a while in the dead of winter, if everything is frozen precipitation, I'll get a few gallons of RO at the grocery store and add a tad less than 1/8 tsp MSU to that . In this year of no winter so far I may be able to use rainwater all winter:wink:.

Bill

I think it would be better to add in a bit of tap water to your rainwater instead of MSU, and fertilize every 3 waterings instead of every 2.

Those 1/8 tsp/gal of MSU is always adding 20-25 ppm of K to the system without the benefit of having it buried in Ca and Mg.

 

[NYEric]

Sorry, all committed.

- I'm sure well be reordering to keep up the supply, and you can jump in then.

OK.

 

[Ray]

With one exception - and if you check your email, you'll know who you are - the K-Lite fertilizer has been shipped.

You will all note that it is VERY heterogeneous. I mixed it as well as I can, but I strongly suggest that you make a stock solution out of all of it for later dilution.

 

[abax]

Might it be advantageous to start a new thread for this
experiment? The discussion/orders are 10 pages long now.
I assume for most of us who want to keep up with developments might appreciate a thread dealing with the
results/observations in a specific area.

 

[Ray]

Probably right, Angela. I'll do just that.

 

[cnycharles]

I was wondering at what total ppm phrag growers would recommend of this fertilizer, for watering species and hybrids? I have an ebb/flood irrigation tank and s/h of some others, wondering what would be the best very low rate to use for feeding/watering phrags? I read in some places where people say phrags are 'heavy feeders' and then others where I read to 'not use fertilizer' very often.
I have two kovachii hybrids that can grow very quickly, so these I might need to ask about a higher rate for them as when I first got them I had slow-release plant food lightly on top of the media.
Would it be better for phrags, for me to sprinkle blood and bone meal on top of the media instead of mixing up fertilizer in the water?

 

[Rick]

I was wondering at what total ppm phrag growers would recommend of this fertilizer, for watering species and hybrids? I have an ebb/flood irrigation tank and s/h of some others, wondering what would be the best very low rate to use for feeding/watering phrags? I read in some places where people say phrags are 'heavy feeders' and then others where I read to 'not use fertilizer' very often.
I have two kovachii hybrids that can grow very quickly, so these I might need to ask about a higher rate for them as when I first got them I had slow-release plant food lightly on top of the media.
Would it be better for phrags, for me to sprinkle blood and bone meal on top of the media instead of mixing up fertilizer in the water?

I feed my Phrags (all species) at the same rate as everything else. Presently that turns out to be 37.5ppm N in a 10% well water. The feeding is done once per week (unless too cloudy, cool). Some things are in SH, some in bark based mix in standard pots, and some are in baskets. The long petaled phrags, besseae, and kovachii are in the baskets.

Obviously the SH systems are going to hang onto the fertilizer longer than the potted systems and baskets, but in just about all cases the SH plants are also big overgrown plants too. I have a big longifolium in SH that is really sucking it down. You saw the pics of the caricinum I posted recently.

 

[Ray]

Just to keep everyone up-to-date:

I finally got the bill for the fertilizer, so could "do the math", and have made a $115 donation to the Slippertalk Fund on all of our behalf's.