Paphiopedilum villosum var. annamense

Discussion in 'Paphiopedilum' started by DrLeslieEe, Nov 22, 2019.

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  1. Nov 22, 2019 #1

    DrLeslieEe

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    After blooming my villosum aureum I started to get more interested in the species. So I decided to try a couple more plants. This one I bought from Tropical Gardens in B.C. from the line breeding of Orchid Inn. The flowers just opened for two days and may expand a little more. I like the color and stance. The other sister plant’s flower should open in a few days so I can compare. NS 10 cm, DS 5.4 cm

    CD8003EB-8236-4891-91D6-6B361D44DC40.jpeg EF93A58F-6746-4069-B42B-4D21B1029C45.jpeg 8B82E47B-0B74-44FF-8E53-D991D319098F.jpeg
     
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  2. Nov 22, 2019 #2

    Ozpaph

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    big, flat dorsal
     
  3. Nov 23, 2019 #3

    DrLeslieEe

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    It is a rather husky looking fella.
     
  4. Nov 23, 2019 #4

    Guldal

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    Lovely! Thx for sharing!
     
  5. Nov 25, 2019 #5

    DrLeslieEe

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    Three days later the flower has stabilized in size and form.

    NS = 10.5 cm
    DS = 5.5 x 5.5 cm
    Petal = 4.0 x 6.0 cm
    Pouch = 3.5 x 6.0 cm

    8EB4627C-1F2B-47EE-BCAD-4EAFCE129AF8.jpeg
     
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  6. Nov 30, 2019 #6

    DrLeslieEe

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    Updated pic a week after it opened. Size is more open and the colour of DS intensified to a yellow background with deep chestnut overlay. I read that villosums can last 60 days. Is this true? My aureum villosum lasted only 30ish days.

    2DF4BD57-73B0-4A4C-9710-67F1361F2D6D.jpeg
     
  7. Nov 30, 2019 #7

    DrLeslieEe

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    In addition the sister plant from same batch just opened as well. Narrower DS that’s green rather than yellow with condense chestnut blotched rather than the webbing. Overall flower dimensions smaller. It has a different bos or umbo colour, which is greenish rather than orange yellow (like the above).I prefer green as in my aureum.

    0576799C-6E88-40AC-BC85-A9A7427A4DF6.jpeg
     
  8. Nov 30, 2019 #8

    Guldal

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    Besides being from Sam's briefing line do you have more specific details about their parentage?!
     
  9. Nov 30, 2019 #9

    Phred

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  10. Nov 30, 2019 #10

    BrucherT

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    love the spread of villosums! You have quite a range but yeah I think these aren’t annamense for reasons Phred elucidated. But who cares! All are wonderful. The dorsal on the first, stout one is spectacular. Might one prevail upon you to include your aureum in this thread?
     
  11. Nov 30, 2019 #11

    Phred

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    You’re mostly correct ButcherT... the reason it’s important is that Leslie shows or has his orchids judged. The AOS has already incorrectly awarded two many villosum as var. annamense. The villosum in Leslie’s photo looks like the newly described... and accepted var. laichaunum. Paphiopedilum villosum var. laichaunum has probably been in the trade for a long time. When ‘Chuck’s Warrior’ was awarded it was awarded just as villosum with no varietal designation. ‘Chuck’s Warrior’ appears to be var. laichaunum therefore all of the (‘Chuck’s Warrior’ x self) would be also. I got a villosum (‘Chuck’s Warrior’ x self) seedling awarded last year. The label said Paphiopedilum villosum var anamense (‘Chuck’s Warrior’ x self). First they compared it to ‘Chucks Warrior’ and according to the judges it was bigger/better than ‘Chuck’s Warrior’ in every respect. Then because the label said var. annamense they compared it to the most recent awarded var. annamense. At the time I didn’t know any better or I would have left the tag out. It was incorrectly compared to var. annamense and was awarded an HCC/AOS as var. annamense. I contacted AOS and provided them with the var. laichaunum information and the question about ‘Chuck’s Warrior’. It took almost a year to hear back but Ron McHatton at AOS said they now accept var. laichaunum and they will be looking at ‘Chuck’s Warrior’ to see if they agree with me that it is var. laichaunum. If they agree they will re-classify ‘Chuck’s Warrior’ as var. laichaunum (with its award) and then they will reclassify my award.
    Attached is a photo of my awarded villosum
    upload_2019-11-30_18-1-7.jpeg
     
  12. Dec 1, 2019 #12

    DrLeslieEe

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    Hi Fred, thanks for this information. I actually looked it up online and in the journals and you and BrucherT are right! The yellow dorsal sepal is a dead giveaway as well as the rest of the flower colours, larger synsepal than pouch, as well as the plant characteristics of smaller size and narrower leaves. Mine have these characteristics and rightly should be labeled var laichaunum. This complex is indeed confusing and so many varieties and colour range.

    And if I decide to bring these two brothers to judging next weekend, I will include the new variety as described in the paper below:

    https://orchidee.de/neubeschreibungen/2018/10/Paphiopedilum_villosum.pdf

    Furthermore, during my background search of the parentage today, the label read Paph. villosum fma amnamense ('Shine & Glory' x 'Chocolate Dorsal' AM/AOS). I asked Sam about it and showed him the flower pics. He says they are not amnamense and possibly labelled wrongly during distribution. This further confirms what Fred was saying.

    BTW Red, your 'Lily' looks like 'Husky's' little sister. I hope you get to show her again this year to correct the variety name and upgrade the award.

    That's why I love ST! You get updated info and tips that would not present itself until too late!

    PS....Now I have to collect the other villosum varieties after looking at the paper. I have possibly the var fusco-roseum (mislabeled as coccineum?).
     
  13. Dec 1, 2019 #13

    Guldal

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    Sorry to be a stickler for precision, but the correct epithet is: villosum var. laichauense, i.e. from Lai Châu, North Western province of Vietnam on the border to China!
     
  14. Dec 2, 2019 #14

    BrucherT

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    Excellent! Here is a nice annamense I found randomly:
     

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  15. Dec 3, 2019 #15

    Hien

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  16. Dec 3, 2019 #16

    Hien

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    And there is this article showing many types of villosum in Vietnam
    http://www.orchid.or.jp/orchid/people/tanaka/orchid/org/shinshu/enshinshu86.html
    Among them I like "Laichau" type the best, and your is a very nice one.
    I saw on the internet, there were even more variations shown by vietnamese than those listed above
    by the way, after one thousand year under Chinese occupation, around 40 AD , the vietnamese Trung sisters threw them out, but different Chinese dynasties attempted invasions again and again almost until modern time. There was a time in 111 BC, the Chinese called Vietnam "Annam" , the French took that word from the Chinese, so villosum annamense is just a type of villosum from Vietnam that the western scientist name after the old country's name.

    Sorry Leslie, I did not pay attention that you already posted the Dutch version of the article, I posted the same thing in Japanese
     
    Last edited: Dec 3, 2019
  17. Dec 3, 2019 #17

    Phred

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    Thank you Hien for those links... I had not seen the first one.
     
  18. Dec 3, 2019 #18

    Hien

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    The one you show may be closer to fusco-roseum than annamense ?
     
  19. Dec 4, 2019 #19

    Elf

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    I'm following this with interest, as I have two Paph villosum, both with very different habit/foliage. The first one has bloomed, and has upright, strap-like foliage - am I correct in assuming this is annamense (photo attached)? The other has very long and floppy foliage - I am eagerly waiting for it to bloom.
     

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  20. Dec 4, 2019 #20

    Ozpaph

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    All very interesting, and technical, but why would adding the 'forma' be important in awarding a species? Surely they are all 'just' colour variations of villosums and should be collectively compared as they are a single species.
     

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