Mini Vini - can you guess the parents

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myxodex

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I got this plant some years ago when my interest in vini's was greater than it is now. This poor plant has been neglected but refuses die and flowers every year. The first pic is from two years ago. This year it has flowered smaller, darker and with a relatively smaller synsepal. The label says it is a primary hybrid but one of the parents has an uncertain species status in that there has been some speculation that it is not a true variety of the species ?. Any guesses what the label says ?

This year:

 
It reminds me of Diana's Winter Day x helenae, so I guess helenae x callosum v. viniferum.
 
The label on the mini vini says: P. dayanum vinicolor x barbigerum. There has been speculation that P. dayanum vinicolor is dayanum x (dayanum x callosum viniverum). This seems reasonable due to the lack of evidence for a naturally occuring population of vinicolor dayanum.
 
The label on the mini vini says: P. dayanum vinicolor x barbigerum. There has been speculation that P. dayanum vinicolor is dayanum x (dayanum x callosum viniverum). This seems reasonable due to the lack of evidence for a naturally occuring population of vinicolor dayanum.

It is a bit more complicated and weird than that...

There has been an original dayanum vinicolor that has been found from wild plants in the Netherlands and died, no progeny.

A couple years later, some people offered flasks of dayanum vinicolor to Klinge, and these are apparently (dayanum x a vinicolor maudiae type) x dayanum, or something similar. Some of them are really beautiful in their own. But they are as well quite 'stable'.

Their progeny is clearly hybrid, but all of the selfings from those plants are vinicolor, where we would expect a percentage to be coloratums. They never, ever do.

Anyway, the 'dayanum vinicolor' in the trade were hybrids, that's clear, but apparently from a much older breeding program where the lines were stabilized. With what species, and how, we don't know. It is interesting to know too that it is the same people behind this hybrids, who got one of the first vinicolor callosum (and sold it to Norris Powell), which puts a lot of question as to what all of those plants are, wild things, hybrids from a very old plant now dead of something else, or whatever...

Similarly, there has been at least twice a lawrenceanum 'vinicolor', that have been lost, once in Linden nurseries at the turn of the century, now dead, and a second time a couple of years ago, dead. The dorsal is just dark burgundy...

Last, I am sure that your plant is dayanum vinicolor x helenae, because Klinge did that cross, and some looked pretty similar... He did not do dayanum vini x coccineum. However he got in trouble, because some people attacked the fact he had helenae crosses, plus he wanted to export to countries where helenae was prohibited. So his plants were tagged dayanum vinicolor x barbigerum v.h. ( v.h. for var. helenae...).
 
Thank you very much for the background Roth, much appreciated. I suspect you are right about this plant originally coming from Klinge and therefore the possibility of it being a helenae cross. I have another vinicolor query, but need to go through my pics first and perhaps I'll post in the taxonomy section.
 
interesting explanation. I saw at a show yesterday a plant that the judges were researching for a possible award, that was labeled 'paph barbigerum var. herrmannii'... I saw one of the computers of the aos judges that was using orchidwiz I think which showed the plants' flowers that looked very much like something called paph x herrmannii... any idea what this particular 'barbigerum variety' might be in reality?
 
My guess is that since barbigerum is long established and was always legal, the smaller related (and less legal) plants are labelled barbigerum in order to be able to sell it more easily. Years ago, helenae used to be sold as "barbigerum v. helenae" and rhizomatosum/vejvarutianum/areanum were all sold simply as "barbigerum".
 
Dear Myxodex,
some years ago I get also two plants of this cross.

dayanumxMaudiaexdayanumSeite.jpg


dayanumxMaudiaexdayanumFront.jpg


here the other darker clone.
dayanumxMaudiaexdayanumXhelenaea.jpg


The plants grew 4 years very well, flowered once per year, but then I lost them, when I travelled some weeks.

The parents of this cross were told Paph. helenae with dayanum vinicolor.
dayanum vinicolor was not the a vinicolored dayanum, it was the cross between Paph. Orchard Slope (Maudiae X dayanum) and Paph. dayanum. The result looked like a dark Paph. dayanum.

It was really a very nice hybrid.

Best greetings

Olaf
 
This reminds me.....I forget which year, but the WOC was in New Zealand. I remember reading in the Orchid Advocate about a "vinicolored argus" there. Whatever happened to that plant, if, in fact, that's what it was?
 

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