Does anyone believe that a true Phragmipaphium has been made?

Discussion in 'Taxonomy' started by kentuckiense, Apr 3, 2007.

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  1. Aug 9, 2007 #21

    bwester

    bwester

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    you can see the blue light used to give that Hanes Magic its strange look reflected on the wall in the background.
    definitley a paph hybrid.
     
  2. Aug 9, 2007 #22

    DukeBoxer

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    Blake, you're right, it looks like someone just did something to it in Photoshop or something, the picture doesn't even look right...
     
  3. Aug 9, 2007 #23

    Rob Zuiderwijk

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    Hi,

    There are on my website two photos of the same plant, made at the same show/meeting, which where made by two different people. I personally think that the other photos has better colours.
    See:
    http://www.phragweb.info/phragmipaphium/hybrids/photos/display_thumbnails_phrphm.asp?phrphm_id=406&phrphm_name=Hanes%27+Magic

    All the best,

    Rob
     
  4. Aug 9, 2007 #24

    bwester

    bwester

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    Rob,
    Whats your take on it though?
     
  5. Aug 10, 2007 #25

    SlipperFan

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    I even took the photos into Photoshop to see if I could correct the colors. The one on the left isn't bad, but the one on the right is way off. I suspect, since they are of the same plant taken by two different people, that the color error is in the light/film chosen. Digital cameras wouldn't help unless they had an accurate white balance setting.

    It's hard for me to compare these two photos with Gilda's because the color is so bad on the two. Sorry, Rob.
     
  6. Aug 10, 2007 #26

    Rick Barry

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    It seems curious that more photos aren't available. It's certainly not for lack of curiosity.

    I can't begin to explain exactly how it happens, but I suspect they are chimeras.

    Regards,
    Rick
     
  7. Aug 10, 2007 #27

    gonewild

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    Looking at both photos from a photographers view they both appear to be taken with a low resolution camera, perhaps an old one? Anybody know when the images were made?
    Also both pictures appear to have been heavily manipulated with an image program which was probably the creators attempt to make poor images better. Since the images are at the very least suspect, they can't really be used to determine if the actual hybrid exists.

    Personally I don't see the Phrag part of the hybrid, it just looks like a Paph to me.
     
  8. Aug 10, 2007 #28

    dave b

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    Hogwash i tell ya. Might as well be looking at the infamous Sasquatch photograph.
     
  9. Aug 10, 2007 #29

    Jon in SW Ohio

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    Sadly, the Mexipedium x Phrag. fischeri ended up being very Phrag dominant as well.

    I won't be convinced either way until I personally make the cross and raise the progeny...so it might be a while ;)

    Jon
     
  10. Aug 10, 2007 #30

    rdlsreno

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    I do agree that they are all Paph hybrids!!

    Ramon:)
     
  11. Aug 10, 2007 #31

    Rick Barry

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    I'd hate to see anyone rush to judgement. Both John Haynes and Fumi Sugiyama were/are growers and breeders of sterling reputations. I can't believe they would knowingly perpetuate a fraud.
    It would be nice to hear from Bob Wellenstein, Tom Kalina or Jerry Fischer to get their take.

    Regards,
    Rick
     
  12. Aug 10, 2007 #32

    gonewild

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    I want to make it clear that I was not suggesting anyone was trying to perpetuate a fraud. My comments about the pictures were not meant to imply that they had been manipulated to look more like a Phrag. The intent was rather to point out that the pictures were not of high enough quality and most likely not original camera takes and therefore should not be used to determine if the hybrid was in fact true.

    The hybridizer may well have used inter generic pollen in an attempt to make seed. But I doubt the Phrag pollen was what set the seed based on the flower shape alone.
     
  13. Aug 11, 2007 #33
    The best photos of Hane's Magic are in the original article, I believe it was March, 1985 in the AOS Bulletin (now Orchids). I may be off by a month, or even a year, but my memory is generally good...about all that's left of my mind. It looks like a paph to me, alway's did. By the way, as I recall, phrag chromosomes look different from paph chromosomes...I think they are smaller...but I may be wrong on that point...can't remember where I saw the articles(s?) comparing the chromosomes, (so much for my good memory.....) but I distinctly remember paphs having larger chromosomes. Take care, Eric
     
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  14. Aug 11, 2007 #34
  15. Aug 30, 2007 #35

    VAAlbert

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    I don't see Phrag in these plants... Cochlopetalum, yes...

    Anyone hear of a Mex x Phrag cross that actually looks real?

    BW,

    V.
     
  16. Aug 30, 2007 #36

    bwester

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    I have heard mex x phrag has been done successfully but without a believable pic, I put it up with the phragmipaphiums.
     
  17. Aug 31, 2007 #37

    NYEric

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    I don't see why these crosses can't be made.
     
  18. Aug 31, 2007 #38

    Heather

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    Eric, it's the same reason we don't cross pigs with goats. :)
     
  19. Aug 31, 2007 #39
    But the breeders gladly cross Vanda with Laelia, Brasavolae, Phalaenopsis and many other genuses. :poke:
     
  20. Aug 31, 2007 #40

    kentuckiense

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    Vanda-Laelia and Vanda-Brassavola have never been done and it will likely stay that way.
     

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