gigantifolium & it's hybrids

[goldenrose]

We're seeing new gigantifolium hybrids making the scene. I'd like to use this thread to discuss first the culture of gigantifolium as a species and then of course let's compare the offspring & see pictures!
How many have straight specie gigantifolium plants? What potting media, light, etc or you giving it?
Are they slow to get to blooming size but after that fairly quick growers?

 

[jtrmd]

Have mine in a bark mix,medium light(Phal light),water up to several times a week,and fertilize just about every watering @ 1/4 strength 20-10-20 jacks peat lite.Once a month I water with epsom salts.I probably dont need to,but it became a habit yrs ago.


It has been a slow grower for me,and still has a little while before getting to blooming size.If anyone knows a trick to speed this one up lmk.

 

[Rick]

I have a handful of seedlings of straight gigantifolium that came from both Orchid Inn and Piping Rock. Initially picked up about 3 (maybe 4??) years ago with about 4-6" leaf spans. Until this winter they were in bark or CHC mixes, and grew OK when it was warm, but lost roots and leaves during winter. One of the bigger plants actually added two new growths over the years, but lost the older growths to slow rots. Very little net growth overall. The epsom salt spiking I started a year ago seemed to stabilize them, but putting them in the sphag basket system they have gone to town. The smaller ones (with only a couple leaves and 1 root apiece) have all doubled in size, double the number of leaves, and have enough roots that I can pick them up by the plant and not have them pull out of the basket.

I grow them in the shadier part of the green house next to the sanderianums and supardii. This is also closer to the wet pad, but on the east side of the GH that gets morning sun, and probably runs a bit warmer than the west side.

From checking the data logger, temps have been staying under 85, and humidity stays >70%

Overall they remind me culture wise of kolopakingii, but wanting less light. They can grow at a pretty good rate when warm and happy, but I hope to have the winter regression licked with the basket system.

 

[goldenrose]

Thanks guys - good input.
Rick - checking out Lance's book, it sounds like your basket culture is the way to go! I can also see where winter could present some troubles, as in nature there's a 6-8 degree temp diff between winter & summer! (My house wouldn't be warm enough for it to be happy, let alone my GH!).
You mentioned supardii, which has similar natural conditions but supposedly does better in an intermediate house for optimum growing results rather than warm, a reason I went with one, are you finding it easier than the gig?

 

[Rick]

Here's my gigantifolium the three on the right are from Sam and purchased in Fall 2006 the two on the left are Fall 2008 purchase from Glenn D. 4" and 6"
baskets for scale. The biggest has a leaf span of 13". The 2 smallest (1 from each source) were virtually rootless 2 leaf plants in January of this year before moving them to baskets.

I'm kind of beating myself over the head for how much abuse I put my multis through for the last 5 years. They could all be much bigger if I knew then what I know now. The supardii have been pretty easy once I got them out of the bright light where the stonei's and roths do so well. I probably lost a year or two keeping my first one way too bright and hot, but they've also been more tolerant of the nutrition issues as long as I get them in very small pots. You may remember some of the old pics of 24" span multi plants in 2" pots. Having that high root mass to mix ratio I think was the only way to cope with heavy watering and high potassium rate. I moved my two adult supardii and a few of the seedlings I've produced over the years into baskets, and they are doing very well.

Anyway it looks like roots are going everywhere now, so I should be able to develop much healthier root mass to foliage ratios.

 

[polyantha]

Here is my P. gigantifolium in flowering size. It is growing very well and the pot was filled with roots in no-time.

Size comparison with Paph. philippinense:

It is growing very well in CHC/ bark mix.
I found out that the gigs are easier the bigger the plant. Young plants are growing slowly. The new growths are developing quite fast:

New growth April 5, 2011:

New growth June 30, 2011:

Keep it humid and avoid direct light. It does not need big amounts of fertilizer.
In nature Paph. gigantifolium is growing close to rivers and ponds. See here: http://www.lacourdesorchidees.fr/Paphiopedilum%20a%20Sulawesii2.htm It does not need very much light (approx. like kolopakingii). If root problems occur, then heat the pot up to 30°C. Bigger plants will recover much faster than seedlings do.

 

[Rick]

Wow, is that a centimeter scale or is that plant pushing 8 ft across?

I think we have some commonalities coming up. Warm and shady.

Also the bigger the plant the faster the growth.

Kind of fits that may be overdosing fertilizer with small plants in proportionately large pots, while big plants in relatively small pots don't get locked up by excess K (especially with bark or CHC mixes).

 

[polyantha]

It is a centimeter scale. That plant has 4 feet leafspan. Hope it will bloom soon.

 

[Rick]

How do you heat the pot to 30C?

Heating mat?

 

[Justin]

Wow they look a little more difficult than i would have thought. Almost as difficult as adductum I'm thinking. I wish I had gotten some seedlings before Sam's stock was confiscated.

Rick I am growing supardii and I find them very easy to grow in my conditions. They are from flask and the biggest are now big NBS plants. I think they are easier than stonei. They do seem a little prone to fungal infection but nothing serious. I am looking forward to seeing them bloom in the next couple years--i've never seen one in real life.

 

[Rick]

Wow they look a little more difficult than i would have thought. Almost as difficult as adductum I'm thinking. I wish I had gotten some seedlings before Sam's stock was confiscated.

Rick I am growing supardii and I find them very easy to grow in my conditions. They are from flask and the biggest are now big NBS plants. I think they are easier than stonei. They do seem a little prone to fungal infection but nothing serious. I am looking forward to seeing them bloom in the next couple years--i've never seen one in real life.

Now that I've changed my fertilizer and potting system around the couple of adductums I picked up from Tom Kalina are moving right along.

I agree that supardii are pretty tolerant barring they don't like bright light. The taxonomists generally compare them to rothschildianum, but culture wise they are nothing like roths. My second supardii was a seedling I got from Tom Kalina (after making my mistakes with a big adult plant I got from Jerry Fisher) and it bloomed only about 4 years after purchase. When they are happy they are very fast growing plants.

I don't think that gigantifolium are going to be hard to grow, but they do like it warm, and when they are in growth mode they can suck up the food and water. The hard part is to be disciplined in the winter to not feed and control watering better.

In some ways growing orchids in pots is more like feeding fish in an aquarium. If they are not eating, and you feed anyway, the food just goes to the bottom and rots. The fish end up dying from bad water quality. Oxygen deprivation and metabolite (ammonia) toxicity.

Things get cool and dark in a lot of greenhouses in the winter. A lot of plants slow down to a crawl. Things are much harder to see in a pot than in an aquarium, and its hard to see potting mixes getting "polluted" by excess fertilizer when the plant is really slowing down. At a certain point, excess potassium will cause calcium and magnesium deficiencies putting a stalled winter plant into a tailspin.

 

[goldenrose]

Wow, is that a centimeter scale or is that plant pushing 8 ft across?
I think we have some commonalities coming up. Warm and shady.
Also the bigger the plant the faster the growth.....

It is a centimeter scale. That plant has 4 feet leafspan. Hope it will bloom soon.

:rollhappy: I was thinking the same thing & wondering what size are those tiles?
That's one long plant polyantha! When did you get the plant & what size was it?
I think we can add to our commonalities that they are not popular because of their size & people don't have the space!

 

[paphioboy]

Interesting discussion. I will find this when I get gigantifolium eventually.. :evil: They're still very pricey at the moment..

polyantha, where are you located?

 

[hardy]

Sad to say, I had one. It succumbed to rot.... :sob:

 

[polyantha]

@ Rick: I heat it up with heating cables. A mat is also possible. You have to be careful with the temperature. Use wet expanded clay (right word?) under the pot so that you have space between pot and heating element.
@Justin: It is not a difficult plant. Adductum is also quite easy and there are parallels between this two species regarding their preferences: warm and wet. The variety anitum is much more difficult than the P. gigantifolium. But it is possible that there are differences within the species.
@ goldenrose: I got the plant a year ago nbs. The new growth appeared few months after receiving it. After this time, the mature growth has only made one leaf, so i think that it is collecting energy for blooming (the standard in my muti-collection).
It is a big plant, but nothing compared to the huge multi-growth kolos. I'm glad to have one in my collection anyway.
@ paphioboy: I'm from Switzerland.

 

[paphioboy]

polyantha, I saw how you revived a rootless randsii on one of the other forums... Did you do the same for this one too?

 

[polyantha]

Hi paphioboy! This plant was just a little bit dehydratet, but it already showed root tips when i bought it. So i didn't repot for two months and after this time it recovered nicely. Now the pot is filled with roots.
If someone is interested in the technique that paphioboy mentioned: http://www.slipperorchidforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=657150
Rescuing a randsii is a damn hard job, trust me. Anitum is even easier.

 

[SlipperKing]

Interesting save Polyantha. So the randsii in now out of the bags and is growing normally now? lots of roots?

 

[polyantha]

You have to know that this randsii is the most difficult plant in my collection, and I have all multis except supardii, ooii and intaniae. (Well, lowii alba, parishii alba and kolopakingii var. katherinae are also missing) And no, there are not lots of roots. There is only one. The thickest root i have ever seen tough. :drool:

 

[SlipperKing]

Hummm... Interesting about the randsii. Keeping my fingers crossed it pulls through. I looked up kolopakingii var. katherinae because I've never heard of that variety. We did have a discussion on the album form of kolopakingii I believe on the forum.