Trouble with Paul Parks

This Paph is in trouble but I don't know what's really wrong with it. All the leaves have these pits and brown patches and even the new leaves become affected in time. No obvious insects. Bacterias would have killed the plant already and the underleaf is quite healthy and green. This is the only plant in my collection that looks like this. Would a virus damage only the top part of the leaves? I only spray my plants with insecticidal soap from time to time for prevention. The plant gets water the same as the others. Intermediate temperatures and good ventilation.
Any idea?

maybe over fertilizing?

Maybe mesophyl collapse???

I think it can be virus too.... Did you test it for CymMV and ORSV? I think you use Agdia test, don't you? Of course it can be another one. Like Fleck Virus....

"Orchid fleck virus (KORV)
The orchid fleck virus usually appears on the older leaves of the plants of Phalaenopsis, Paphiopedilum, Cymbidium, Coelogyne, Oncidium and other orchids, whereas young leaves still look healthy. First symptoms on the leaf surface are spots or stripes, with increasing infestation the tissue concerned becomes dry, there are white-grey, clearly defined sunken spots, but not on the underside. Subsequently there is secondary fungus infestation and the infested areas turn black. The virus can be latent in the plant without showing the above-described symptoms. They may appear any time on the leaves, if the plant is exposed to stress. "

http://www.hark-orchideen.de/Pflanzenschutz/Virosen/biologie.php?lang=en&navID=99&page=2

Where do the symptoms start from? Leaf tip? Leaf base? How quickly does it 'spread'?

Can you post a photo of the whole plant, thanks. I'd isolate this one.

Erythrone said:

Maybe mesophyl collapse???

I

Click to expand...

Looks like it. It seems like after the cell collapse and once it gets exposed to strong light. It turns brown.

I had one on my philippinense. I will post a picture. Not as severe as this one but pretty similar.

eggshells said:

Looks like it. It seems like after the cell collapse and once it gets exposed to strong light. It turns brown.

I had one on my philippinense. I will post a picture. Not as severe as this one but pretty similar.

Click to expand...

I agree! I was thinking the same thing! Wasn't there a heat wave back east this year with temperatures above 30 C! Also the parents are not high light plants.

Paphman

Paphman910 said:

I agree! I was thinking the same thing! Wasn't there a heat wave back east this year with temperatures above 30 C! Also the parents are not high light plants.

Paphman

Click to expand...

Yeah. We were troubleshooting this a while ago. When my condo reached 31c and I have left on the weekend. The plants got heat stressed and this thing manifested. I dont know if cold can do that also.

Those brown spots started as really white spots and sunk a bit. Then it turned brown. Now I caught it right away so some of the white turned back to green but unfortunately it left those marks.

If you need a high res pic to compare I can send it to you.

Good luck!

There is some similarities but it's much worse for me. I didn't think of last summer heat but it's possible. The last two leaves are not as bad. I'll post a pic tomorrow.

paphioboy said:

Where do the symptoms start from? Leaf tip? Leaf base? How quickly does it 'spread'?

Click to expand...

The leaf tips are OK. I first noticed the brown patches and mesophyl collapse on the bottom leaf last summer, then it got much worse on the leaf above it. It doesn't seem to be spreading now though the new leaves have some slight pittings on top. Maybe I'm giving it too much light. I'm inclined to think Paphman910 might be right.

Erythrone said:

Maybe mesophyl collapse???

I think it can be virus too.... Did you test it for CymMV and ORSV? I think you use Agdia test, don't you? Of course it can be another one. Like Fleck Virus.

Click to expand...

Actually, I have far too many plants and it would be impractical and very costly to check them all for viruses. And then I would always worry anyway about false positives and false negatives. I'm very strong however on sterelyzing cutting tools everytime I use them. There's no point taking chances. I've thrown out many plants on suspicion of diseases, viruses or not. To me, nothing is worth the space in my growing room if it's always sick, doesn't ever flower or sits there sulking for too long. In short, I can live with viruses if the plants look healthy, grow well and flower well.

The three lower leaves are the most affected. The top new leaves have a few pits an mesophyl collapse that are too small to show on these photos.

I didn't think of it first but too warm and too cold temps...Could that be it?

I was under the impression that mesophyll collapse primarily resulted from tissue getting suddenly overcooled, not from getting too warm (which I don't think the quoted temperature are, anyway. My GH got up into the 90's a few times over the summer, and I've seen none of that.)

Now, if they were that warm and you hit them with cold water...

However, those first photos don't look like that to me, anyway.

i don't know if you could send it to Critter Creek labs here in the US or is there a lab that could test for virus up there?

Hi Ray, our weather here in the prairies gets really really dry so that was a combination of both the humidity that day clocked at 29% RH.. Shiva's plants are in the GH so humidity may not be the problem.

I have ready that if the leaves surface are warm and gets hit by cold water. This can result to cell collapse also.

eggshells said:

Shiva's plants are in the GH so humidity may not be the problem.
I have ready that if the leaves surface are warm and gets hit by cold water. This can result to cell collapse also.

Click to expand...

Not in the g/h anymore. The plant is in my growing room inside the house. But it spent a good part of the summer outside and cold night rain at 10°C may have caused this. Such injuries often take time to develop and I may just be seeing the full damage now.

You guys help me a lot figuring out what I'm doing wrong in this case. I can never thank you enough.

Eventually, I plan to keep the phrags and paphs inside the house all year and cool the growing room with an air conditionner in summer. No more cold rain, no more bugs coming in with the plants and lesser risks of bacterial or fungus infections.

I've gotten the same exact thing on multies before. The one that comes to mind is a Lady Isabel X sandie. I think in the case of mine, it was a combination of poor roots and some extreme weather. My plants are never outside so the cold rain never bothers my plants and it probably didn't effect yours either.

SlipperKing said:

I've gotten the same exact thing on multies before. The one that comes to mind is a Lady Isabel X sandie. I think in the case of mine, it was a combination of poor roots and some extreme weather.

Click to expand...

Rick, how is your plant now?

likespaphs said:

i don't know if you could send it to Critter Creek labs here in the US or is there a lab that could test for virus up there?

Click to expand...

I think like you...:sob:

just to be sure
i have no idea whether or not it is actually a virus
one would also have to be sure that the lab can test for the virus you're concerned is there