kentuckiense
Debaser
Ah. I will defer to Hakone on this one. Probably knows a lot more about these than me.
Paph micranthum, what varity is this?
- Thread starter SlipperKing
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SlipperKing
Madd Virologist
Thanks Hakone. I appreciate your keen eye.
Kentuck, again thanks for your input as well.
G
goldenrose
Guest
:drool: Share with us the difference please!
:clap: Congrats Rick 'The King'! :clap:
The pressure is on to keep it alive, grow & rebloom it!
G
goldenrose
Guest
Can you describe the difference or show pics?
Hakone
Well-Known Member
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G
goldenrose
Guest
:clap: Thanks Hakone- a picture is worth a thousand words!
parvi_17
Well-Known Member
Those are definitely regular micranthum leaves. var. eburneum has much wider leaves, as kentuckiense said. Also, they have silver spots on a very dark green background, so the mottling is slightly different as well. It's a very nice micranthum, though!
parvi_17
Well-Known Member
Nice pics Hakone!
kentuckiense
Debaser
Check out the pics from slipperorchids.info:
var. micranthum:
http://slipperorchids.info/paphdatasheets/parvisepalum/micranthum/Paphmicranthum(topview).jpg
var. eburneum
http://slipperorchids.info/paphdata...thum/Paphmicranthum(var)eburneum(topview).jpg
Here's a quick and dirty photo of mine. var. eburneum on left, var. micranthum on right.
var. micranthum:
http://slipperorchids.info/paphdatasheets/parvisepalum/micranthum/Paphmicranthum(topview).jpg
var. eburneum
http://slipperorchids.info/paphdata...thum/Paphmicranthum(var)eburneum(topview).jpg
Here's a quick and dirty photo of mine. var. eburneum on left, var. micranthum on right.
NYEric
Well-Known Member
I'm suprised it's so teenie! I can't wait to get one to bloom and to get some thaianums! Yay mini Parvis!!!
SlipperKing
Madd Virologist
That sounds like a wonderful plant Eric.
I've bloomed micranthums before, granted this is the first eburneum if that is correct, but none of the others I've bloomed have been so little. I was very surprised to see that it was "teenie". I think on future bloomings it will be much larger.
Leo Schordje
wilted blossom
Hey Rick,
I only play a taxonomist when prognosticating on the Web, I am not a real taxonomist. With that comment made, I have been growing and occasionally blooming micranthum var eburnum for many years. I do not feel your plant is eburnum. I think your plant is likely from Viet Nam. The description of micranthum var eburnum says they come from Kwong See (Cantonese transliteration of the Chinese province name) The leaves are a MUCH deeper blue green than the color of the leaves you have pictured. There are relatively few silver flecks in the leaves so the overall effect is a blue-black leaf color. The pouch is nearly pure white with just a hint of pink around the edges. The pouch interior does have the same dark spotting. The background color of the dorsals and petals are more yellow fading to white. Some eburnum flowers almost look albino.
(I read on the internet) There was a large (probably illegal, but don't really want to go there) importation of hundreds of micranthum collected in Viet Nam that turned up with a number of California growers in 1997. Most were sold as 'seed' raised plants, so their origin information was lost. (laundered)
They have the lighter colored leaves of type micranthum, but they have pouches that vary from bi-colored pink & white through to a nearly white pouch. They are not var. eburnum because that variety only comes from China, and has the very dark colored foliage. But because they have the white or mostly white pouch people incorrectly call them eburnum.
I recently bloomed a dwarfish micranthum that I am guessing is from that 1997 Viet Nam collection, though I would not be able to prove one way or the other where it came from. I am guessing your plant is from that same sub-population. Here is my picture. I think I would just leave the label as Paph micranthum, or micranthum Dwarf Variety, and resist the temptation to call it eburnum. You might also send your photos to Olaf, see what he thinks.
The foliage that Kentuckiense has posted as being var eburnum is too light, unless that light color is an artifact of the flash. I would doubt that his is true var.eburnum either. Sorry, not trying to be negative, that is just this man's opinion. The proof will be in the blooming. When my laptop gets back from the shop I will post images of both eburnum and normal micranthum. But that may be a few weeks away.
- Leo
I only play a taxonomist when prognosticating on the Web, I am not a real taxonomist. With that comment made, I have been growing and occasionally blooming micranthum var eburnum for many years. I do not feel your plant is eburnum. I think your plant is likely from Viet Nam. The description of micranthum var eburnum says they come from Kwong See (Cantonese transliteration of the Chinese province name) The leaves are a MUCH deeper blue green than the color of the leaves you have pictured. There are relatively few silver flecks in the leaves so the overall effect is a blue-black leaf color. The pouch is nearly pure white with just a hint of pink around the edges. The pouch interior does have the same dark spotting. The background color of the dorsals and petals are more yellow fading to white. Some eburnum flowers almost look albino.
(I read on the internet) There was a large (probably illegal, but don't really want to go there) importation of hundreds of micranthum collected in Viet Nam that turned up with a number of California growers in 1997. Most were sold as 'seed' raised plants, so their origin information was lost. (laundered)
They have the lighter colored leaves of type micranthum, but they have pouches that vary from bi-colored pink & white through to a nearly white pouch. They are not var. eburnum because that variety only comes from China, and has the very dark colored foliage. But because they have the white or mostly white pouch people incorrectly call them eburnum.
I recently bloomed a dwarfish micranthum that I am guessing is from that 1997 Viet Nam collection, though I would not be able to prove one way or the other where it came from. I am guessing your plant is from that same sub-population. Here is my picture. I think I would just leave the label as Paph micranthum, or micranthum Dwarf Variety, and resist the temptation to call it eburnum. You might also send your photos to Olaf, see what he thinks.
The foliage that Kentuckiense has posted as being var eburnum is too light, unless that light color is an artifact of the flash. I would doubt that his is true var.eburnum either. Sorry, not trying to be negative, that is just this man's opinion. The proof will be in the blooming. When my laptop gets back from the shop I will post images of both eburnum and normal micranthum. But that may be a few weeks away.
- Leo
Rick
Well-Known Member
Leo
Has your "dwarf" variety bloomed more than 1 time (i.e. is the trait consistent with the plant)?
Has your "dwarf" variety bloomed more than 1 time (i.e. is the trait consistent with the plant)?
Leo Schordje
wilted blossom
My dwarfish micranthum has bloomed twice, and so far the trait seems consistient. Your plant makes the 2nd dwarf I have heard of. If your stays consistient, we may have stumbled into a new "variety" of micranthum. Because we do not have collection data, at best we could list this as a horticultural variety. We should not refer to it as a taxonomic variety. That would only muddy the water further. The foliage of your dwarf is nearly identical to the foliage of my dwarf.
On the same theme there is a dwarf form of armeniacum that comes from Yin Nan, I had seen a few a decade ago, but I think they were mostly lost because their flowers were not big enough for the growers to stay interested in them. I am keeping my eye out for this one also. Ross, you thinking about these in a breeding program?
I don't want to discourage anyone who may have paid extra for a micranthum eburnum, but there are really very few true var eburnums in the USA, and some of the dealers may actually not know the differance and may be unintentionally sell the slightly more common white pouch Viet Nam type wrongly thinking they have true var. eburnum from Kwong See, China. Regardless, I have never seen a micranthum that I did not find at least pretty to exquisitly beautiful. It is a wonderful species. All of them are a delight to bloom.
On the same theme there is a dwarf form of armeniacum that comes from Yin Nan, I had seen a few a decade ago, but I think they were mostly lost because their flowers were not big enough for the growers to stay interested in them. I am keeping my eye out for this one also. Ross, you thinking about these in a breeding program?
I don't want to discourage anyone who may have paid extra for a micranthum eburnum, but there are really very few true var eburnums in the USA, and some of the dealers may actually not know the differance and may be unintentionally sell the slightly more common white pouch Viet Nam type wrongly thinking they have true var. eburnum from Kwong See, China. Regardless, I have never seen a micranthum that I did not find at least pretty to exquisitly beautiful. It is a wonderful species. All of them are a delight to bloom.
SlipperKing
Madd Virologist
Thanks for the info Leo...At the time of the photo w/ quarter the flower measured ~1 inch across and 1.5 vert which is pretty teenie. I believe it has expanded more.
kentuckiense
Debaser
Leo, my plant is from the Kwongsi sib cross offered by both Orchid Inn (http://orchidinnusa.com/plants.jsp?kind=paphiopedilum&type=species&page=2) and Orchids Limited (http://www.orchidweb.com/detail.aspx?ID=1219). Perhaps it is due to not white-balancing my camera before taking the photo, but my plant has silvery-blue leaves.
SlipperKing
Madd Virologist
Well, I thought the small size was due to stress but maybe I am really surprised! It would be cool to capitalize on this unique trait.
kentuckiense
Debaser
I agree. I'm a big fan of miniature slippers.
NYEric
Well-Known Member
The dark color in the leaf tasselations of eburneums I've seen was bluish-green.
