Wanted: Paph tigrinum

[Roth]

Why so much? Are they really that rare or something?

In culture, they are very rare, because there is no reload from the wild, unlike most other paphs species. The collector in China works for only one nursery, which sells those plants at a premium price per growth, all counted ( one tiny start is one growth, one 2 leafed old growth is one growth).

It is not rare in the wild, but no one is interested financially yet to find another collector in the same area, as it requires a lot of logistics ( stay there for some days or weeks, hope that he goes to the right place... and that he does not want a high price like his competitor...). In the trade, what keeps the price down are:

- Collectors who compete. As a result, sanderianum went at a time down to 8USD a big wild plant, gigantifolium down up to 3USD. As the market for paphs goes down dramatically, some collectors stopped working forever, and the prices are really up lately.

- or good in vitro labs that can sown and propagate the plants. Tigrinum is not 'difficult', it is quite specific. There has been a few times quite a bit of flasks made from one single seed capsule, in the USA and in the Netherlands, as well as twice in Taiwan. The seedlings were strong, and they grew like weed.

Paphiopedilum malipoense as an example is very difficult to grow from seed to blooming size fast and in big quantities, in a reliable way, but the collectors compete so much that the price for a mature plant is really cheap. Most of the trade consists of wild plants cultivated for a while indeed...

Paphiopedilum charlesworthii is very easy to grow from seed, so the price is low because it is easy to grow from flasks.

For tigrinum, the wild plants are already too expensive, there are not so many plants blooming in cultivation to make seeds, and the labs screw up a fair amount of seeds of it...

 

[Eric Muehlbauer]

Tigrinum really should not be as expensive or rare as it is, considering that it really does grow like a weed. I had one that came as a tiny slip of a plant. It rapidly grew into a multigrowth plant that had mutliple blooms each year. My problem was that I divided it so many times...sent out a lot of it in trades. Unfortunately, bad bark (Rexius) and a hot summer killed my last division several years ago. I've been kicking myself ever since.

 

[Scott Ware]

I can tell you that the strong cultivars do grow like weeds, but growing them from seed is something else. My Paph. tigrinum seed capsule remained on the plant for a little over 18 months. It still wasn't turning so I finally just sent it to the lab. 20 beautiful, vigorous flasks were produced. All the seedlings in the bottles looked fantastic. They were all of the same cross from the same capsule, from the same mother flask and had received identical treatment during replating and right up until delivery.

These were carefully deflasked (these were in the Kelsey Creek grow boxes so there was absolutely NO damage to the seedlings) and placed into 20 identical compots. Within 2 weeks 17 of the compots had rotting seedlings and within a month all the seedlings in those 17 compots were completely gone. The remaining 3 compots grew like dandelions with almost zero attrition. It was extremely frustrating that only the Paph. tigrinum did so poorly because the over 500 other various paph species compots that had been set out in the previous several months were ALL doing very well.

I have heard of similar experiences with Paph. tigrinum from several other growers. It germinates well, replates well, but is very prone to committing suicide in the compot. Something had to be different for those that survived - but I can't imagine what it was.

 

[Ray]

If I remember correctly from Holger Pernar's paph Forum talk in February, he notes that it took three in-flask stages - each with its own medium formulation - to emerge well.

 

[Rick]

These were carefully deflasked (these were in the Kelsey Creek grow boxes so there was absolutely NO damage to the seedlings) and placed into 20 identical compots. Within 2 weeks 17 of the compots had rotting seedlings and within a month all the seedlings in those 17 compots were completely gone. The remaining 3 compots grew like dandelions with almost zero attrition. It was extremely frustrating that only the Paph. tigrinum did so poorly because the over 500 other various paph species compots that had been set out in the previous several months were ALL doing very well.

And then some one posted a pic a few years ago (from the West Coast too) of flats of tigrinum, some in bloom. I think the thread caption was something like "I waited too long".

I've been nursing along a couple of seedlings I got from Sheerwood in 2002. They're up, they're down, and then back up. Finally going to basket culture and K lite, they seem to be going to weed status. I'm pretty sure the biggest is about to break out of bloom blast syndrome too.

 

[Scott Ware]

Yes, those were the survivors in the photo of that flat of seedlings.

 

[Rick]

Yes, those were the survivors in the photo of that flat of seedlings.

Thanks for reminding me Scott.

Have you bred any of those plants?

Have you tried a low K diet yet?

 

[Rick]

Yes, those were the survivors in the photo of that flat of seedlings.

Thanks for reminding me Scott.

Have you bred any of those plants?

Have you tried a low K diet yet?

It seems to reduce the rot potential of paphs.

 

[Scott Ware]

No, I haven't been able to get anything back from the seeds I have harvested for the past couple years, due to so-called mishaps and misdeeds by a couple flaky labs. I need to concede that there is no longer a reliable local service and just go ahead and send the seeds out of state.

I haven't tried low K yet - but I'm reading, with interest, the experiences of those who have.

 

[Roth]

Flasking tigrinum and even villosum is tricky, if the seedlings are pushed too much and have not enough ventilation, they start an anaerobic process, they look nice, but after a few weeks or months, they would collapse and die. The only way if you get such flasks is to treat them with fungicides straight out of flask, then they perform well. I always use Subdue, Aliette and Rizolex as a bath, then drench the seedlings. So far I do not loose even the runts of anything, and the growth is not stopped, unlike some bozos said supposedly when you use fungicides on tiny seedlings...

I have seen wild plants with close to 100 growths too... The bud blast syndrom does not exist at all, the nursery in Kunming blooms hundreds of them every june/july so far, and not a single bud blast. On the other side, they spend 3 months in the winter dry and cold, that's the trick ( same for micranthum and sometimes malipoense), the plants look a bit dehydrated, but they plump up and look beautiful when he waters them heavily again, around march.

 

[newbud]

There's a new division on Ebay
It looks like a really nice one and came from a huge plant.
It's at a $152.50 right now and it's still got 5 days left. It started at $50 so I think there will be a battle for it. Wish I had the bucks.

 

[newbud]

Ended: Jul 29, 201218:33:33 PDT
Winning bid:
US $280.00 [ 28 bids ]
Shipping:
$10.00 USPS Priority Mail
Item location: Washington State, United States

 

[NYEric]

HMMM, wish I had bought more as an investment!

 

[jtrmd]

Ended: Jul 29, 201218:33:33 PDT
Winning bid:
US $280.00 [ 28 bids ]
Shipping:
$10.00 USPS Priority Mail
Item location: Washington State, United States

I should sell mine

 

[Tom-DE]

I should sell mine

I should sell mine too.:rollhappy: I am not kidding tho.

 

[NYEric]

I have a quarter! :evil:

 

[Tom-DE]

Gees, Eric. I give you a dollar. You poor thing!:rollhappy::evil:

 

[NYEric]

I have my tigrinums! :evil:

 

[Tom-DE]

Now may I have yours for a quarter?:evil: I don't mind having another clone.