Paph leaf issues

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mSummers

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I have two paths that have developed leaf issues and I’m not sure what it is. Please let me know your thoughts.

First up is a Paph parishii that has cell collapse. It’s visible from both sides of the leaf, but only a one or two spots have turned brown.

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Second is a Paph stonei that looks fine from the top, but has brown spots on the underside of the leaf.
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these two plants sit next to each other so I initially thought the issue was related but now I’m not sure.

I water by drenching the bark media, never by pouring water over the whole plant so I don’t think the issue with the parishii is mesophyll cell collapse.

I also wiped the leaves of the stonei with a paper towel and didn’t get any residue off the leaf, so I don’t think it’s mites.

Thoughts?
 

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Ray

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Just a guess, but I’m thinking acidovorax (pseudomonas). I’d start with a copper treatment.
 

orchid527

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I'll be honest, that is a lot of damage. Even if they manage to recover, it will be years before they are healthy, robust growers. The only value they have right now is that they might offer clues to what may soon happen to other plants.

I believe much of what you see now is secondary infection. If you can rule out environmental damage from too much light and heat, I think the best bet is spider mite. I know you have looked, but you really do need something stronger than a magnifying glass. Isolate these two, and once you have confirmed the source of the problem, throw them away.

Years ago I read an article suggesting that stressing a plant like this is like flipping a switch, so that even when perfect conditions are restored, the plant will never thrive. It is a survival strategy that benefits the species at the expense of the individual. Don't know if this is really true, but it would explain a lot of the things I have seen. Mike
 

mSummers

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I took a look with a photography loupe and see no mites. After talking with Tre at Little Brook I’m fairly certain that it is bacterial or fungal. Tre also advised tossing them due to the amount of damage, which I hated to do, but I think he and Mike are correct, that these will never thrive.

When it gets warmer I’ll treat the entire collection with Physan as a precaution
 

southernbelle

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I'll be honest, that is a lot of damage. Even if they manage to recover, it will be years before they are healthy, robust growers. The only value they have right now is that they might offer clues to what may soon happen to other plants.

I believe much of what you see now is secondary infection. If you can rule out environmental damage from too much light and heat, I think the best bet is spider mite. I know you have looked, but you really do need something stronger than a magnifying glass. Isolate these two, and once you have confirmed the source of the problem, throw them away.

Years ago I read an article suggesting that stressing a plant like this is like flipping a switch, so that even when perfect conditions are restored, the plant will never thrive. It is a survival strategy that benefits the species at the expense of the individual. Don't know if this is really true, but it would explain a lot of the things I have seen. Mike
I agree about needing more than a loupe which is usually 10x. Mites (and thrips at larval stage) that I’ve found on orchids (paphs in particular) can be hard to see with 30-40x. Wipe with a Qtip dipped in alcohol and look at the Qtip. They might be squirming which makes them easier to see.
 
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