Paph chamberlainianum vs victoria-reginae

[Cochlopetalum]

Thank you Roth, it sounds likely. I did not know victoria-mariae could have mottled leaves, I have not dared to cultivate the species yet, sins it´s more sensitive. The pictures I've seen has been of plants with plain leaves. Mt Merapi is a good match with that conclusion.

 

[SlipperKing]

Are you sure of the date Rick. I found no entry for Guido on that day. It may be the month before.

At any rate, I do remember reading a bad exchange between Guido and others at the end of which he said something like: ''That's it, I quit!'' I don't remember the exact circumstances though.

New information:
Dr Braem's last entry was on September 2 and I quote precisely: ''OK that's it ... I am no longer wasting my time with idiots like you and Hakone''

The Sept 2 date was probably the last time he posted any reply but if you look up mrembers from the tab above you will see Braem logged on and probably didn't post on the 09/23. It's what Eric refers to as "lurking"

 

[Shiva]

Oh! I wasn't aware that logins were counted even when no posting was done. Thanks for the info.

 

[Roth]

Thank you Roth, it sounds likely. I did not know victoria-mariae could have mottled leaves, I have not dared to cultivate the species yet, sins it´s more sensitive. The pictures I've seen has been of plants with plain leaves. Mt Merapi is a good match with that conclusion.

The plants with plain leaves are the one you usually see today, as there are very, very few people crazy enough to order jungle plants ( that's why victoria mariae is rare in cultivation too...).

Fro my experience the colonies of plants with mottled leaves tends to have an orange pouch, the plain green leaves are more purple violet.

Here is a picture of a mottle leafed victoria mariae:

One more note about chamberlainianum. So far there are many hybrids sold under that name, that came from Van der Weijden in Kudelstart. When I tried to get original chamberlainianum, I usually ended up with the 'latifolium' type.

The real 'latifolium' form of chamberlainainum have extremely, hard like wood, thick leaves, with a rough surface. You very clearly cannot bend them without breaking them.

The normal chamberlainianum has quite coriaceous leaves, but much softer. Many plants have tesselated leaves, sometimes very heavily. It is a very rare species from the wild nowadays.

Liemianum has smooth leaves, much softer.

victoria mariae has leaves that may well be amongst the largest of Paphiopedilum overall ( the 3ft from Sander is a reality, I measured a couple of mine a few days ago, and the leaves are about 80+cm x 5-7 cm wide, floppy. The texture would be something between sangii and spicerianum when they come from the wild.

Anyway, except buying fresh jungle plants from the collector, I would not trust anyone selling cochlopetalum 'species'. I have seen too many people going to the Netherlands, from the USA, from Europe, and from Japan, choosing from pot plants, and tagging them as primulinum, glaucophyllum, liemianum, chamberlainianum... for the last 15 years. I do not think there are many real primulinum around either...

And, what is the most important, the Dutches had 3 nurseries/joint ventures with Indonesian growers as early as the 70's.

So there are a lot of Pinnochios, Pinnochios yellow, Avalon Mist, etc... around in Indo.

 

[Cochlopetalum]

Thanks you for all that information, Roth. This is a real problem for me trying to collect cochlopetalum species. Ther are only a few of my plants that feels realy genuine. These are some of my liemianum from Röllke, two plants of kalinae (difficult to grow sufficient) from Orchid & More. And possibly one young plant of latifolium from Popow, it has hard, leathery, succulent and broad leaves with a rough surface. Not as woody as you describe, but the plant is young and grown at my home , leafspan only 33 cm.

 

[Cochlopetalum]

Maybee I should give my latifolium some more light, that might produce some harder growth, I grow it in a rather low light position.

 

[paphioboy]

The real 'latifolium' form of chamberlainainum have extremely, hard like wood, thick leaves, with a rough surface. You very clearly cannot bend them without breaking them.

The normal chamberlainianum has quite coriaceous leaves, but much softer. Many plants have tesselated leaves, sometimes very heavily. It is a very rare species from the wild nowadays.

Liemianum has smooth leaves, much softer.

victoria mariae has leaves that may well be amongst the largest of Paphiopedilum overall ( the 3ft from Sander is a reality, I measured a couple of mine a few days ago, and the leaves are about 80+cm x 5-7 cm wide, floppy. The texture would be something between sangii and spicerianum when they come from the wild.
.

Is it possible for you to post a picture of these plants side by side to compare? I'm sure most of us will find it easier to distinguish between the members of this complex subgenus if we can see what the actual plants look like.

 

[NYEric]

I didn't think he [Guido] was talking about me!

 

[Shiva]

I didn't think he [Guido] was talking about me!

Not specifically! oke:

But when you quit for two or three people, you also quit for everybody else.