Rick
Well-Known Member
http://www.uky.edu/Ag/Horticulture/anderson/orgfert1.pdf
This article shows that organic ferts have EC too.
This article shows that organic ferts have EC too.
K-Lite Testers: What do you grow, and have you made any observations?
- Thread starter Ray
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K
keithrs
Guest
Interesting....
Rick
Well-Known Member
I don't know if any of you checked this article out, but thought the analysis of two different kelp products was striking.
"Algamin" liquid 0.2 - 0.0 - 0.4 Ca = 0.46, Mg = 0.62
"Ohrstom's Garden Maxicrop" (powder) 1.0 - 0.0 - 4.0 Ca = 0.66
Mg = 0.24
In both cases, phosphorus is very low (there is some on actual analysis), and K is higher than N. But in Algamin, Ca and Mg are higher than K, but this is reversed in Maxicrop.
E
Eric Muehlbauer
Guest
OK.....now after almost a year and a half of using K-lite, I think I have finally noticed some patterns. First- if plants are going downhill, or about to go downhill, K-lite is no panacea. It has not saved any plants in poor condition.
Second- plants that are doing well continue to do well, and in fact, seem to do better. That for me is the important part. I try to repot more or less yearly, and this is the time of year that I do most repotting. Normally, repotting reveals a number of paphs that I thought were doing well, but turn out to be rootless or on their way to being rootless. This is not happening as much, if at all. Plants are turning out to have healthy or growing roots at a much greater rate. I still don't get heavy, extensive root systems on paphs, but these are good, healthy systems, about as good as my paphs usually get. So....I'm definitely glad I switched over.
Second- plants that are doing well continue to do well, and in fact, seem to do better. That for me is the important part. I try to repot more or less yearly, and this is the time of year that I do most repotting. Normally, repotting reveals a number of paphs that I thought were doing well, but turn out to be rootless or on their way to being rootless. This is not happening as much, if at all. Plants are turning out to have healthy or growing roots at a much greater rate. I still don't get heavy, extensive root systems on paphs, but these are good, healthy systems, about as good as my paphs usually get. So....I'm definitely glad I switched over.
Since I don't really understand the chemistry, I'll simply state that I pot
all my Paphs. in Orchiata and have been using K-Lite for more than six
months. ALL my Paphs. are doing very well, several one growth plants
are in bud or blooming and I haven't lost a single plant and have actually
saved a few trade plants in bad shape when I received them. In addition to the Paphs., I'm using K-Lite on Phals. and various other plants in my
greenhouse including a lime tree and all have improved...better roots,
better foliage, better color. I'm well pleased with K-Lite and I thought my plants looked good before using it. They look GREAT now.
BTW, good on you Ray.
all my Paphs. in Orchiata and have been using K-Lite for more than six
months. ALL my Paphs. are doing very well, several one growth plants
are in bud or blooming and I haven't lost a single plant and have actually
saved a few trade plants in bad shape when I received them. In addition to the Paphs., I'm using K-Lite on Phals. and various other plants in my
greenhouse including a lime tree and all have improved...better roots,
better foliage, better color. I'm well pleased with K-Lite and I thought my plants looked good before using it. They look GREAT now.
BTW, good on you Ray.
And in the case of KelpMax, it's a 0-0-1.
Rick
Well-Known Member
Eric
I'm glad you are seeing some good signs with your plants. What rate (dose and frequency) are you feeding at?
Also did you ever pick up a soil probe TDS meter to see what pot conditions were doing? I turned around a lot of poor doers by spending more time (and water) just flushing out high TDS pots that had accumulated a bunch of K from all the previous MSU feeding.
I'll throw my two cents in...
I would not expect any fertilizer to help save a plant - unless it was starving - any more than I would expect filling up the gas tank to fix a broken-down car.
The first Greencare-produced batch of K-Lite came in to me in late November/early December of 2011, and I have been using it exclusively since then. For 4 months, I was applying it at 125 ppm N, but then dropped it to 50. I apply KelpMax at 256:1 irregularly, every 4 to 6 weeks, manually with a hose end sprayer. I would be more regular, but having two full-time jobs SUCKS. I have not applied it since September, due only to my crazy schedule.
My paphs are growing significantly larger, the blossoms are easily 10% bigger on most of them, and in several cases, bigger. Plants are producing more leads, although that tends to happen with more mature plants anyway, so I don't know how much of that I can even casually attribute to the feeding regimen.
I am seeing great growth on other genera, as well. My cymbidiums have more blossoms per spike than I have ever seen, and some seedling onciidinae types are throwing up really big spikes.
I would not expect any fertilizer to help save a plant - unless it was starving - any more than I would expect filling up the gas tank to fix a broken-down car.
The first Greencare-produced batch of K-Lite came in to me in late November/early December of 2011, and I have been using it exclusively since then. For 4 months, I was applying it at 125 ppm N, but then dropped it to 50. I apply KelpMax at 256:1 irregularly, every 4 to 6 weeks, manually with a hose end sprayer. I would be more regular, but having two full-time jobs SUCKS. I have not applied it since September, due only to my crazy schedule.
My paphs are growing significantly larger, the blossoms are easily 10% bigger on most of them, and in several cases, bigger. Plants are producing more leads, although that tends to happen with more mature plants anyway, so I don't know how much of that I can even casually attribute to the feeding regimen.
I am seeing great growth on other genera, as well. My cymbidiums have more blossoms per spike than I have ever seen, and some seedling onciidinae types are throwing up really big spikes.
Rick
Well-Known Member
In some ways having high K around was technically "starving" plants of Ca and Mg.
So I would say it was possible to turn bad plants around. It depends on how bad and how bad the potting mix was.
Without roots its definitely a steep uphill battle to bring them back, but I did have that happen. Back before K lite came out, and I was working with the MSU work around, I also used doses of epsom salts to help overcome the K induced deficiencies. Mg (unlike Ca) is easily moved through a plant, even with poor roots.
Once the plant was "unlocked", having a low salt potting mix around was critical as the plant would try to generate new roots. There was a time lag between when I did this by guesswork, and when I got the conductivity meter to give me actual data to work by.
But yes I have crappy plants turning around.
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Eric Muehlbauer
Guest
One of these days I'll get a TDS meter...I really should. I hate math, so I simply use 1 tspn/gal for Vandas, Catts, strap leaf paphs, hybrid and large sized phrags. 1/2 tspn/gal for the rest of my paphs, Phrags besseae and schlimii, pleurothallids. Under lights plants get it every 2nd watering, window plants get it seasonally...every 2 weeks now, weekly in spring/summer (none for some of my species cool growing paphs until Feb.) I've never tried kelp or seaweed extract. To be honest, I can't afford that many extras. I've been skimping on potting materials as it is. I really need to make a big orchiata and sponge bark order. I also use too much ebay (damn! why do I have to win? I think I'm being cheap and I'm sure I'll lose....) My kids have to find work and get rich.....
No, I don't overload my plants with additives. I use K-Lite exclusively at
1/4 tsp. per gallon once a week in the summer and whenever I have a sunny day or two right now (which isn't often). I agree with TN Rick that
many of us often fertilize waaaay too much and add whatever happens to
be the fad of the moment when unsuitable culture is the problem, not
nutritional needs.
1/4 tsp. per gallon once a week in the summer and whenever I have a sunny day or two right now (which isn't often). I agree with TN Rick that
many of us often fertilize waaaay too much and add whatever happens to
be the fad of the moment when unsuitable culture is the problem, not
nutritional needs.
Justin
Well-Known Member
I am still using Rick's early MSU K-Lite workaround (MSU for pure water/Epsom Salts/Calcium Nitrate). Also have added a dilute kelp product.
I also made the change to mix back in 50% tapwater with my R/O. This gets the water pre-fert to close to 100 ppm. With fert the ppm is approx. 250.
With these changes I have had no recurrence of rot in my collection. Have lost a few plants that were already going downhill but the whole collection has stabilized and is growing very well. New growths are very hard and strong, where I had been having a huge problem a year ago with new growths being very soft and rotting easily. I believe that issue was caused by mineral deficiency from using pure R/O for 5-6 years.
So with the above changes I have had a great turnaround in my collection.
I also made the change to mix back in 50% tapwater with my R/O. This gets the water pre-fert to close to 100 ppm. With fert the ppm is approx. 250.
With these changes I have had no recurrence of rot in my collection. Have lost a few plants that were already going downhill but the whole collection has stabilized and is growing very well. New growths are very hard and strong, where I had been having a huge problem a year ago with new growths being very soft and rotting easily. I believe that issue was caused by mineral deficiency from using pure R/O for 5-6 years.
So with the above changes I have had a great turnaround in my collection.
wjs2nd
Well-Known Member
I have been toying with the idea of adding tap water to my RO water. What kind of chemicals and additive do you need to worry about in tap water? I know you can sit tap water out for a day or two in the sun and gas-off some of them.
I am going to get the water test from the city. Ray, do you have anything on your website to help me understand the meanings of these test numbers?
I am going to get the water test from the city. Ray, do you have anything on your website to help me understand the meanings of these test numbers?
K
keithrs
Guest
Chlorine and chloramine are the big one you want out.
Chlorine will gas off faily quickly... And even faster if you airate it. But chloramine has to be removed via a carbon filter.
You can get a 24" housing fairly cheap as well as the filters. I plumbed mine in outside before my tap. I also have a whole house carbon/ceramic filter.
wjs2nd
Well-Known Member
So a carbon filter, like on a brita, will remove the chloramine? That is nice to know. Does it remove any important minerals though?
Rick
Well-Known Member
No major ions, but can remove some trace metals. But it all comes back with the fert if you are using MSU or K lite or kelp.
In tap water the only thing significant to take out is the chlorine/chloramine, and carbon is very effective for that.
wjs2nd
Well-Known Member
So what does tap water have in it, that doesn't get removed, that RO water can not supply the plant. Hence, why add tap water?
