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Greenthings

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I created this post well knowing that perhaps only a few will be able to read it, for if it is classified by Heather and company as as "inflammatory" it WILL be taken off the forum and moved out of sight.

I have therefore sent this post by private e-mail to several of my friends who belong to this ST forum. Just a safety precaution.

I have just received the following private e-mail, after I asked where I could find the thread "Storm Brewing at the RHS over registration etc," which no longer seems to be where it was, at least when I looked there. Things can change here in seconds and it may be back there as I write this.

Here is the part of that e-mail, verbatim:

"The administration (Heather) have created a new section on SlipperTalk called OutBack. They will move all "inflammatory" and argumentative posts to that section. Readers need a password from the administration, so you need to PM Heather for the password. Phrag has already slammed you in the Outback"

Thus soon we will only see "KISSY KISSY" post and no more civil dicussions and arguments, all because a few administrators could not behave in a civil manner?

It seems to me that this Administration has no intention to change and make this forum BETTER and MORE RESPECTABLE, as recommended, NOR DOES IT SEEM DETERMNINED TO SHOW MORE RESPECT for its members.

They are thumbing their noses at all they were told by people like Eric Muehlbauer and John Marcotte.

To avoid having to improve their own "condemned by members" actions, on this forum, they simply created another section on the forum, OUTBACK, where the administrators can carry on as before. Vindictive attacks as before. I think this OUTBACK was simply created for them and for another reason, which I will discuss further down in this post.

The fact that one of the first posters in OUTBACK is PHRAG, according to te e-mail, who continues his vindictive attacks on me, proves it.

This is unbecoming any PUBLIC forum, for it is more like a Mafia back room where a few decide which decent and civil forum contributor they are going to stuff in the concrete box next.

The second danger of OUTBACK is that any regular forum post, no matter how decent and civil it is, can simply be classified by the administration as Inflammatory and moved to OUTBACK, when they do not like it.

Thus we now have a much easier censorship vehicle giving the administration complete power as to who will be heard and who will be gagged,for all they have to say is: " WE are the administration and WE have
classified your post as inflammatory." You may think this can not happen, I think it will happen!!

You, S.T "administrators, do neither have any idea about, nor do you understand what the definition of a public forum is. If you have to take your own UNCIVIL posts out of sight, they should never have been posted in the first place.

So you created a vehicle where no one has to apologize for their bad behaviour, but can carry on as before, but now one can stuff a lot more material in OUTBACK, on which to take out your frustrations.

So much for taking advice from decent subscribers recommending that this forum needs to change and so much for some of you given a tiny glimmer of hope that you would make a chance for the better. My conclusion is that you have just made it worse.

If you believe this will encourage people to post on ST, think again and take off your blindfolds, please.


peter
 

Ron-NY

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I did not realize that it would be a locked area that did not leave easy access for all to participate in if they so chose. I thought it would be an area with a disclaimer, on the part of the administrators, that that information posted here does not reflect the opinion of the Forums administration.
 

Heather

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Peter, would you be happier if the password was listed in the description?

All you had to do was PM me for it. I believe it states that quite clearly to all registered members of this forum. If you were logged in and could not see the new forum, then something is not set up correctly and someone needs to let me (or the other three admins of this forum) know.

If you are not a registered, logged in user, you won't be able to see the forum. That is true.
 

Heather

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Ron-NY said:
I did not realize that it would be a locked area that did not leave easy access for all to read.
I don't believe it is locked. You just need a password to enter, just like at OSF.
The password is drama. Don't visit if you don't want to see some. :) There are members here who don't, and members here who do. Now it is your choice.

If something is not functioning please let me know but I created a test account this morning and it looked as though it was set up as intended.
 

bwester

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he will never be happy Heather. There will be something else after you do that.
 

kentuckiense

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Heather said:
Peter, would you be happier if the password was listed in the description?

All you had to do was PM me for it. I believe it states that quite clearly to all registered members of this forum. If you were logged in and could not see the new forum, then something is not set up correctly and someone needs to let me (or the other three admins of this forum) know.
I'm pretty sure he'd much rather publicly wave his persecution complex around instead of simply contacting someone.
 

Heather

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Clearly, we here at ST try to pay attention to all of our members. Before you climb all over us, maybe you should just ask a question privately and get an answer.

If there is a problem, we may not know unless you bring it to our attention, but it doesn't need to be done in a confrontational way.

We are trying do deal with issues as they arise and make informed decisions based upon a collective community desire.
 

Ron-NY

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sorry should have said password protected and not locked...not much difference unless the password is posted in the description allowing easier access...
 

Candace

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Heather, just my opinion, but to make the area easily accessible to all members I think the password should be in the description.


Edit: You're fast!
 

Heather

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Candace said:
Heather, just my opinion, but to make the area easily accessible to all members I think the password should be in the description.


Edit: You're fast!
I'm trying! :)

Just FYI, because several times in conversation this has come up today.

We established this forum on June 6th of 2006. We set it up in 6 days. On the 7th, we invited you all here. 7 days prior to that I was a moderator elsewhere. I was never privy to the inner workings of Vbulletin. Nor was John. Nor were the other people who are still administrators here. We left a forum, and six days later we opened one ourselves. We are learning. We were learning then, and we are still learning now.

We might make some mistakes but we'll try to rectify them for the forum's well being, in the meantime the members are going to have to be a bit patient with us. :pity:
 

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Peter,
I am neither an administrator, nor involved in any way in the Pk saga. I am just a sometime commentor on this forum, and as an (unbiased) observer of some of your posts, I do think you are out of line and tend to be inflamatory in your remarks.

Originally Posted by Greenthings
Fact remains, with the exception of a few, you all judged my character without really knowing me.

This is an example of a broad generality that I doubt is true, and only seems to ruffle more feathers. Few of us have passed judgement on you, and if we have, how can you be so certain what conclusion we came to? It is obvious that you hold some passionate opionions, but what are you trying to accomplish here? If you want to persuade someone toward your view, then a more patient approach may be more productive. Just some constructive critism, do with it what you will.

I think the majority of us, though perhaps tangentially interested in these goings on, are more interested in sharing information about plants we enjoy growing and seeing. And more than a few of us, I would guess are concerned that angry posts and emotional responses are hi-jacking our forum, to the point there has even been suggestion made it may fold.

Now the administrators are working to placate all of us, and jumping on them for coming up with what seems like a good attempt to keep information flowing, seems a bit premature and unreasonable.
Eric
 

gonewild

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kentuckiense said:
The more you post, the more I am convinced that you are absolutely, positively insane.
Zack?
Is that good behavior?
If you disagree with someone's opinion say why, but don't throw insults.
Bad behavior.
 

kentuckiense

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gonewild said:
Zack?
Is that good behavior?
If you disagree with someone's opinion say why, but don't throw insults.
Bad behavior.
I'll take my first warning from the administration.

Furthermore, you can tell me your thoughts without using the rhetorical questions one usually reserves for small children.
 

kentuckiense

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Peter,
I'm sorry for insulting you. I could've been far more constructive.

I think ohio-guy did a very good, and far more temperate, description that sums up my opinion very well, too.
 

gonewild

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kentuckiense said:
I'll take my first warning from the administration.

Furthermore, you can tell me your thoughts without using the rhetorical questions one usually reserves for small children.
OK.
What purpose did what you wrote serve?
That is not a rhetorical question.
 

kentuckiense

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gonewild said:
OK.
What purpose did what you wrote serve?
That is not a rhetorical question.
It served to reflect my personal frustration with Mr. Croezen's inability to resolve issues without making it a "LOOK AT ME" flag-waving persecution fest.

As has been made clear to me by several members, my reply was not acceptable. I realize that, and I apologize for that, and I'm making every effort to reign it in.
 

gonewild

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Peter,

Give it a chance. It is not all that bad. Since anyone can have the password it is a public forum. Let's consider it an Adult Section. Anyone in there reading has no right to complain that it is bothering them to have the content on the forum. They are obviously there on purpose.

As far as I'm concerned there is never a proper time to call someone a name or insult them unless you are standing face to face.
You made your point but I think the forum is trying to adjust to what it's members want. Go to the OutBack and argue it out.

I think a public forum should not be a place where people call each other names and throw insults but rather address someones opinions and statements with like kind.

I don't see the OutBack as censorship at all.
 

gonewild

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kentuckiense said:
It served to reflect my personal frustration with Mr. Croezen's inability to resolve issues without making it a "LOOK AT ME" flag-waving persecution fest.

As has been made clear to me by several members, my reply was not acceptable. I realize that, and I apologize for that, and I'm making every effort to reign it in.
Excellent Zack! That is good behavior. And I mean that as a complement.

Now why should you care if someone toots their own horn?
 

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